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VGCW Suggestions and Feedback; Ideas welcome!
Topic Started: Jul 29 2015, 03:07 PM (57,540 Views)
FoxyStalin
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Ladies Love it.
This has been said elsewhere but I figure I'll drop a comment into the Comment thread

The TOHmes have been top shelf recently, between Vegeta's Coronation, Heavy being Credit to Team, Edgeworth and Pheonix's backstage talk, Red's Staredown, and the proclomation that Dracula cannot defeat Air Man, Charecters are getting fleshed out and expanded, and it's just resulting in a lot of hype for everything.
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Fireball Spam
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I've said a lot already in the characters threads and will probably write more in the future, but for now I just wanted to drop in and say that End Game X1 was phenomenal. I didn't mind the length either, as this was an extra-special occasion with the first AtTOHtude Era finale and the debut of the new channel as well.

Something I really liked at End Game was how the Gameshark started doing more malicious things. For example, everyone was so hyped up when "Live and Learn" began, only for the Gameshark to immediately speed through a chunk of it. The crowd got mad as hell and, due to the speed-changing gimmick of the match, we feared there was a very real possibility that the song would be entirely sped through and be followed by three minutes of slow-mo set to one of Toad's songs. Another great example of the Gameshark being a jerk was when it took Sabin's gains right before the long-awaited bro showdown between him and Knuckles (who Gameshark had buffed up to boot).

Also, this was something subtle, but I loved how you took advantage of the AI's hatred of leaving the ring in HIAC matches to actually make the picture-in-picture easier to see. Octodad and Glitch Man were always in clear sight and Lakitu didn't have to zoom out to follow them on the outside. That coupled with the Ring of Fire in Segata vs. Glitch DK made it easier to follow the action simultaneously while bringing in the natural hype those match types have. Plus, the cell kept security (or anyone else) from interfering as well, so it worked on several levels.

I noticed some talk about Megalovania "taking over the chat", but I didn't really think it had that effect. Chat always likes to talk among itself a bit more in the opening of matches, and after the long and dramatic conclusion to the Gameshark plot people were still kind of catching their breaths. I loved the name pun for the match too, and it's a good song to boot.

As a suggestion, I noticed that the VGCW Championship match is the only one without a unique name on the doc. How about calling it "Iron Blue Intention"? It's the name of a Castlevania song, Air Man is a blue robot, and both competitors definitely had iron wills in that match.
Edited by Fireball Spam, Dec 4 2015, 01:08 PM.
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Ebnasgbxpo
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Don't know if this has been mentioned here before, but how about a section in Wrestler Discussion for tag teams?
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GirthIgnorer
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I usually catch up on Youtube because I work so late and I admit I'm a monster who skips through the intermissions and such. Would it be possible to put in the title when a stinger's in the end credits?

I think this is a fits thing? So as always, even if this change is made thank you for allowing me to watch the show :dan:
Edited by GirthIgnorer, Feb 4 2016, 12:11 AM.
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Cran Rightia
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Director of Kitties
VGCW has stingers in every episode as a rule, now.
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TOH
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More sizzle than a rasher of bacon.
Wanted to leave a note here to encourage you guys to give us any feedback you've got, good or bad. I'm not going to ignore the fact that viewership has hit a decline since I've started running things, but I'd like to at least know if that's the result of specific things about VGCW turning you away from it or if it's just general burnout or anything like that. The amount of feedback compared to the Bazza era is incredibly small, so I want to keep hearing from you guys.

I can't guarantee that I'm going to cater directly to feedback, but it'd be good to know what things people don't like about the show as I don't feel VGCW has received much criticism since I started. I don't mean that as a way to brag or anything. I just want to ensure that people aren't holding too much back.

Viewership isn't everything, but I know that some of you have followed VGCW for years, and I want to ensure that the loyal fans are happy with how we're doing. So if you've got any suggestions or anything of that sort, please let us know, it'll greatly help. Thanks!
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Mosaique
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>dirtsheets
I personally feel that not enough people are talking about the show. Back then, there were various forums where people talk about the show. Now, most people just use their private chat for discussion. There's barely any movement in the forums, and it's stagnating.

Then again, there was Twitchcon panel where over 40k people watched the show. That's entirely different subject though.
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Bazza
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Alright, dudes?
TOH
Feb 24 2016, 03:03 PM
viewership has hit a decline since I've started running things
I hope that you don't feel that this is due to how you run the show, I'm sure that's not the case. Viewership dropped under my era compared to the first seasons. I think Mosaique hit the nail on the head. I think the word needs spreading.
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Mosaique
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>dirtsheets
I think people are getting too comfortable.

Way too comfortable.

"Tribalism" or "Segregation" is best way to describe it.

I've joined various private chats on Discord where people talk about VGCW and many other things. There's lot of movement there, and it's nice. HOWEVER, in this forum, for example, the only movement is Daily Discussion and that tournament thing. Nobody bothers to talk about the show or wrestlers other than the show date. Servers shutting down didn't help either. That pretty much put all rosters and many other things on lock.

Just as I am writing this right now, I am seeing lots of people talking about this subject in private chat. Yes, I can read that and other people there will. Nobody else can.

For the Twitchcon itself, the combination of botched links and four internet personalities that lots of people didn't recognize probably had to do with it. Nevertheless, I rather have 500 people who are interested in this show than 2000 people who vomit meaningless garbage.

VGCW itself is better than ever, and I love it. But many people are keeping it to themselves and most activities are done behind the scenes.
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TOH
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More sizzle than a rasher of bacon.
Mosaique
Feb 24 2016, 03:32 PM
Nevertheless, I rather have 500 people who are interested in this show than 2000 people who vomit meaningless garbage.
I can completely agree with you on this. But I'm also worried about keeping those 500 around. Because we've lost about that many since Season 10.
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Introbulus
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I feel like the problem is pretty much just burnout. I mean, the quality of the show hasn't declined - if anything, it's either remained as good or gotten even better than before, and the Beach season is some of the best stuff the show has had in a long time.

But...that's just it. The show has been going on now for a very, very long time.

I don't think it has to do with a quality dip of any kind, but I did notice the viewership drop, and the drop in forum discussion and general discussion of VGCW, and I think it all boils down to a long-coming burnout for a lot of fans. VGCW is great, but, and this is the part that is hardest to admit, despite the quality of the show and the entertainment of the idea, the core of it stays very much the same, episode after episode after episode.

There was a certain rare novelty in the very idea of VGCW early on, that the show was driven by fate rather than script, and that it took itself just seriously enough that it could be light-hearted while still carrying with it a real plotline.

The latter I think is why a lot of people still stick around - the fact that there's some pretty fantastic plotline and comedy going on every night at VGCW.

But I think early on, there was a lot of novelty to the idea, and a lot of people stuck around out of loyalty even when the novelty wore off.

Then there was Bazza's departure, and the big TwitchTV event.

Now I don't hold Bazza's departure against him for one second. He made VGCW what it is, and left on good terms and for good reasons. But, a lot of folks I think felt like Bazza leaving was the end of an era. And good or bad, it was a signal for some to pack up and leave, not out of spite, but more out of...a sense of timing, feeling like they could let go.

I feel like TwitchTV stream had the same effect on people. It was by far the biggest public showing of VGCW ever...and in a way, the show's peak of fame. And after you reach a peak, you feel kind of like it's time to come back down.

None of this is anyone's fault. Bazza left for legitimate reasons, and TwitchTv stream was a big event no one should've turned down. It's more a feeling. A feeling that once something hits an apex, or changes dramatically, that there's a sort of liminal phase in which you feel you're 'allowed' to leave, that you've seen what you wanted, and that it's time to go.

I'm not going personally. I still enjoy the show and I'll keep enjoying it for a long, long time. And, there's one other possibility, though I haven't got numbers to back it up - a lot of fans might just be choosing to watch the recordings more than they did before.

But regardless, I don't think the show is missing anything, and I don't think I'm going to stop watching.

Because for me, personally...I think I benefit from the methodical pace.
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LIGHT_GUNNER
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why am I still here
All I will say is that currently the show is pretty good. I did notice that since the last episode voices have been turned off. Did the 13 lines Cole have finally make you snap?

Also VGCW's roster has changed a lot. We went from Hitler, Game Grumps, Obama, etc. to some really odd (albeit awesome) additions like Sho (only found out about TWEWY a year ago), Zubaz, among others. It's a shame you said that some EDBW superstars might never make it due to limited knowledge on how to write them (Would love to see Eddie Riggs or Sam & Max in the VGCW arena) but EDBW wouldn't be the same without them. I know this probably sounded a bit gibberish, but still good job.
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DesuBlade
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深いダー♂ク ・ ファ♂ンタジー♂!
I'll attempt to expand on Introbulus's main point. A lot of people always synonymised VGCW with Bazza. Once he left, a lot of people felt like VGCW had ended and thus people left. It's not to do with the quality, it's mostly to do with memory. And before Bazza left, there was about 700-800 people there for regular Season 10 episodes give or take. It feels like because more people have been there to really explain how the mechanics of 2K14 work in comparison to '13's days, there's less spontaneity with the matches and people see things happening and already predict the finish to a match and they'd be right instead of the old days where they'd be wrong.

It's very hard to really connect with VGCW as with other mediums of Twitch streams as there's usually a field of familiarity when watching a stream for a game you want to see because you've played it before or have that chance to play it at any time. With VGCW and with the servers dying, it doesn't have that. I understand that both of my points could easily be countered and be proven wrong, but it's ideas less than solid opinions I have of the decline in VGCW viewership.

It would be fantastic if VGCW got the audience it once had, but advertisements these days are spearheaded with the constant notion of "you must watch this thing it's the best thing ever" as opposed to "hey this thing exists and is kinda cool watch it if you get a chance". I know that if the time for a VGCW advertisement from somewhere else were to happen, the latter would occur than the former. But, it's all dependent on how people who see the advertisement view it as.

VGCW is in a tough situation right now in terms of viewership. I still enjoy the shows I do enjoy greatly, but it's hard to really ignore the lack of participation.
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AaronTheBaron
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Yo, it's me. It's me. It's A.T.B.
Personally, I don't feel like the show itself needs any adjustments that much. However I do feel that the "advertising" and word getting out definitely could use a bit of an uptake.

Even without Bazza leaving and that inevitable turnover happening, the show also moved channels to the VGCW channel on Twitch that is used now. However while people that follow on Twitter/Forums/YouTube saw that, there's probably a good amount of people that didn't see that as well. I don't know how you try and reach back out to those people, but I feel like upping the "get the word out about it" quota needs to be bumped up.

In combination with the Bazza era ending and the switch over, viewership was bound to go down some. So we have to find a way to get viewers back in or get new viewers, and while I don't know how to do that, getting the word out more to people outside the VGCW Fanbase as it currently stands is important.

I also feel like to someone coming in new, chat may seem a little intimidating. You come in to VGCW, and imagine if the first thing you see is chat in all caps yelling out "The Gay Community" when Kanji hits his finisher, or Barret making an entrance and all you see is a swarm of "Hey" from everyone. Heck, even just the all caps thing probably is a bit intimidating to some new viewers. It's an environment that's meant to symbolize a wrestling crowd, sure, but what about the people who just want to talk with others about the matches? The forums maybe, but that's more inbetween the matches and segments, and less during them unless something really amazing happens. Not sure how to change that, though.

On a complete side note that is more on the line of my crazy ideas I came up with one day, I think it'd be cool one time to try and have commentary provided by the people in the VGCW community, and have Cole and King turned off. Either through a Discord server or Skype or a separate stream. It's probably a crazy idea, like I said, but maybe it'd be something cool to try once or twice.
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KappaKappaKappa
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I have two issues.

First, I think the first is that the era of 2k14 has gone on for way too long and there is a degree of burnout. Granted there isn't much choice in the matter with regards to switching to another game, but I have been subject to the overall same style of matches for a long time, and as time goes on I have grown rather...smarky about why certain things happen, especially when understanding the mechanics behind the game. The matches are starting to blend into each other for me and it's becoming less about "Oh man this is competitive" and more "He blew his comeback, he's probably going to lose now". I find myself favoring matches less because of the wrestling itself and more because of who was in it, what the result was and probably the choice of background music.

2k14 isn't a very good game to draw people in. There's no real spice to bring in new fans or bring back old fans who stopped watching.

My second issue comes from the overall canon. VGCW has been around for years and has developed an extremely strong continuity, but this is both a blessing and a curse. There are characters and even some storylines have been around so long and developed so much that it creates a bit of an accessibility barrier for viewers, especially newer ones. I think the stories are well written, but don't allow for much flexibility if you were to jump in and catch your first/return VGCW experience with a midseason episode.

I think the problem is made worse when referencing storylines from previous seasons. As a recent example, when Barrett was making his case to Drac for his title shot there was constant references to events that happened well before I even started watching. There are similar nuances to interactions where I don't understand the importance of certain statements or actions, or why the crowd reacts a certain way when certain things happen and it makes it hard to be invested and very easy to change the channel.

Between the VGCW lore, the lore of the wrestler's original games, the mechanics of 2k14, and even the lore of real wresting promotions, I think there is too much a viewer needs to know to fully enjoy the experience
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