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Season 12 Discussion; VGCW: World Tour!
Topic Started: Jan 5 2016, 04:35 PM (92,527 Views)
Buwaro
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jnWake
Mar 9 2016, 09:39 PM
How long has it been since we saw a spear through the barricade though?
Sho did one in his first match this season. I think it was in Episode 2/Mute City?
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NottyRose
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A rose, by any other name...
I mean, there's really never not been some kind of overarching plot.

S1 literally started the show with the Baz McMahon/Little Mac/Zangief plot, S2 had Mr. L beating everyone up back stage, S3 had the Great Tournament, S4 was Wrestlevania, S5 had the Dragon Balls, S6 had the Phoenixes, S7 the Ring Rangers, S8 the Robots, and S9 had another tournament and Nightmare Gabe and S10 had Nightmare Gabe again.

There's really never been a time when VGCW didn't have some kind of overarching plot, there's only the degree to which it's dominated the show. And honestly, I'd say the Robot Master plot and the Dragon Ball storylines were much more intrusive than what Bison's done, even if Bison's spots were chosen more deliberately.
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NottyRose
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A rose, by any other name...
I'm not saying it couldn't or shouldn't be done, heck S7 of WV doesn't really have any major overarching plot and it's been fine, exemplary even.

Just that people talking about the 'good ol' days' before invasive plots may be misremembering a touch. Really, the closest we've had to a season like that is 11, and that's mostly because the Gameshark was a fun and pretty harmless gimmick.
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JCW555
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The Archives Guy
NottyRose
Mar 9 2016, 10:09 PM
I mean, there's really never not been some kind of overarching plot.

S1 literally started the show with the Baz McMahon/Little Mac/Zangief plot, S2 had Mr. L beating everyone up back stage, S3 had the Great Tournament, S4 was Wrestlevania, S5 had the Dragon Balls, S6 had the Phoenixes, S7 the Ring Rangers, S8 the Robots, and S9 had another tournament and Nightmare Gabe and S10 had Nightmare Gabe again.

There's really never been a time when VGCW didn't have some kind of overarching plot, there's only the degree to which it's dominated the show. And honestly, I'd say the Robot Master plot and the Dragon Ball storylines were much more intrusive than what Bison's done, even if Bison's spots were chosen more deliberately.
Good point Notty.

I dunno, maybe I'm being dumb or I'm missing it (I very much could be missing it), but I miss the spontinatity of VGCW. I also miss wrestling telling the story instead of the plot.

This could be me being dumbass, like I said.
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WhytePanther
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Remember last year when we were excited for this?
JCW555
Mar 9 2016, 10:22 PM
NottyRose
Mar 9 2016, 10:09 PM
I mean, there's really never not been some kind of overarching plot.

S1 literally started the show with the Baz McMahon/Little Mac/Zangief plot, S2 had Mr. L beating everyone up back stage, S3 had the Great Tournament, S4 was Wrestlevania, S5 had the Dragon Balls, S6 had the Phoenixes, S7 the Ring Rangers, S8 the Robots, and S9 had another tournament and Nightmare Gabe and S10 had Nightmare Gabe again.

There's really never been a time when VGCW didn't have some kind of overarching plot, there's only the degree to which it's dominated the show. And honestly, I'd say the Robot Master plot and the Dragon Ball storylines were much more intrusive than what Bison's done, even if Bison's spots were chosen more deliberately.
Good point Notty.

I dunno, maybe I'm being dumb or I'm missing it (I very much could be missing it), but I miss the spontinatity of VGCW. I also miss wrestling telling the story instead of the plot.

This could be me being dumbass, like I said.
Travis just spent an entire plot segment ridiculing his tag team partner for losing to Virgil. We're still getting the spontaneous stuff, but it's just not necessarily at the top of the card.
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NottyRose
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A rose, by any other name...
It's fine. Everyone's allowed to like or not like things at their own discretion. It's just important to keep some perspective in all of this.

Edit: Yeah, like what Panther said.
Edited by NottyRose, Mar 9 2016, 10:27 PM.
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JCW555
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The Archives Guy
WhytePanther
Mar 9 2016, 10:25 PM
JCW555
Mar 9 2016, 10:22 PM
NottyRose
Mar 9 2016, 10:09 PM
I mean, there's really never not been some kind of overarching plot.

S1 literally started the show with the Baz McMahon/Little Mac/Zangief plot, S2 had Mr. L beating everyone up back stage, S3 had the Great Tournament, S4 was Wrestlevania, S5 had the Dragon Balls, S6 had the Phoenixes, S7 the Ring Rangers, S8 the Robots, and S9 had another tournament and Nightmare Gabe and S10 had Nightmare Gabe again.

There's really never been a time when VGCW didn't have some kind of overarching plot, there's only the degree to which it's dominated the show. And honestly, I'd say the Robot Master plot and the Dragon Ball storylines were much more intrusive than what Bison's done, even if Bison's spots were chosen more deliberately.
Good point Notty.

I dunno, maybe I'm being dumb or I'm missing it (I very much could be missing it), but I miss the spontinatity of VGCW. I also miss wrestling telling the story instead of the plot.

This could be me being dumbass, like I said.
Travis just spent an entire plot segment ridiculing his tag team partner for losing to Virgil. We're still getting the spontaneous stuff, but it's just not necessarily at the top of the card.
Like I said, I could be dumb and completely missing it.

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Introbulus
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I really like what's being done with all the non-champ, non-Bison stuff, and I'm also willing to wait to see what happens with Bison and the missing belt. (I can think of at least two wrestlers who would like to grill Dracula about his missing belt).

At the same time, I don't think we've ever before been Sonic 3 Emerald State's so hard about the championship title as we are right now, so while Grand Dad is a good start to a payoff, whatever the end result is, it's gotta be good to justify this kind of move.

I also can't wait for the dragons and shadow ball valley to be back next week, and give their two cents about all this.
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Neerrm
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I'm always the man.
I'd like to see Bison do something more substantial than gloat that he's winning because people feel things. Would've been neat to see what would happen to Flint had that progressed.
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Weldar
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WhytePanther
Mar 9 2016, 10:25 PM
JCW555
Mar 9 2016, 10:22 PM
NottyRose
Mar 9 2016, 10:09 PM
I mean, there's really never not been some kind of overarching plot.

S1 literally started the show with the Baz McMahon/Little Mac/Zangief plot, S2 had Mr. L beating everyone up back stage, S3 had the Great Tournament, S4 was Wrestlevania, S5 had the Dragon Balls, S6 had the Phoenixes, S7 the Ring Rangers, S8 the Robots, and S9 had another tournament and Nightmare Gabe and S10 had Nightmare Gabe again.

There's really never been a time when VGCW didn't have some kind of overarching plot, there's only the degree to which it's dominated the show. And honestly, I'd say the Robot Master plot and the Dragon Ball storylines were much more intrusive than what Bison's done, even if Bison's spots were chosen more deliberately.
Good point Notty.

I dunno, maybe I'm being dumb or I'm missing it (I very much could be missing it), but I miss the spontinatity of VGCW. I also miss wrestling telling the story instead of the plot.

This could be me being dumbass, like I said.
Travis just spent an entire plot segment ridiculing his tag team partner for losing to Virgil. We're still getting the spontaneous stuff, but it's just not necessarily at the top of the card.
The real big example I'd point to right now is this whole King Vegeta angle. He got this title from a tournament that came about (If I'm remembering correctly) because TOH didn't have time to do a full show but had just skipped the week before and didn't want to skip two in a row, the writing team took the result of this spontaneous tournament and has spun it into a great angle.

I've only been around for about two seasons so I can't speak with much authority but it seems like the biggest difference with whats going on right now is the overarching plots getting in the way of other plots. As crazy as the gameshark was it didn't really do much to mess with what was going on, as Segata pointed out it didn't mess with main events and title matches and even smaller plotline matches tended to be messed with in more harmless fun ways. It was even used to help push a plot along with the whole bighead Haggar vs Layton. Bison has quite deliberately been breaking this rule, obviously there's some payoff in mind for that and I'm early awaiting that but yeah there's naturally going to be some people for whom that's a bridge too far.
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JCW555
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The Archives Guy
Weldar
Mar 10 2016, 08:00 PM
WhytePanther
Mar 9 2016, 10:25 PM
JCW555
Mar 9 2016, 10:22 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Travis just spent an entire plot segment ridiculing his tag team partner for losing to Virgil. We're still getting the spontaneous stuff, but it's just not necessarily at the top of the card.
The real big example I'd point to right now is this whole King Vegeta angle. He got this title from a tournament that came about (If I'm remembering correctly) because TOH didn't have time to do a full show but had just skipped the week before and didn't want to skip two in a row, the writing team took the result of this spontaneous tournament and has spun it into a great angle.

I've only been around for about two seasons so I can't speak with much authority but it seems like the biggest difference with whats going on right now is the overarching plots getting in the way of other plots. As crazy as the gameshark was it didn't really do much to mess with what was going on, as Segata pointed out it didn't mess with main events and title matches and even smaller plotline matches tended to be messed with in more harmless fun ways. It was even used to help push a plot along with the whole bighead Haggar vs Layton. Bison has quite deliberately been breaking this rule, obviously there's some payoff in mind for that and I'm early awaiting that but yeah there's naturally going to be some people for whom that's a bridge too far.
Yeah. Maybe I'm still kinda bitter and eh about season 8, but the over-arching plot taking over the whole shows plot and wrestling is something that I don't want again. Even Bazza said that he hated booking the robots halfway through. Bison already did that by interrupting the main event of Blood Money, and I got the season 8 vibes from that.

From TVTropes (which has great VGCW articles BTW):

Seasonal Rot: Season 8 is regarded by many, including Bazza himself to be the weakest season on VGCW overall due to the Robot Master plot taking up a considerable amount of time away from other wrestlers. Season 9 managed to rectify this by giving much more emphasis on the wrestlers and their interactions with one another, and was regarded as a huge step up over Season 8, with some considering it to be the best season in the show so far.
Edited by JCW555, Mar 10 2016, 08:38 PM.
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Prozach
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NOPE.
Weldar
Mar 10 2016, 08:00 PM
The real big example I'd point to right now is this whole King Vegeta angle. He got this title from a tournament that came about (If I'm remembering correctly) because TOH didn't have time to do a full show but had just skipped the week before and didn't want to skip two in a row, the writing team took the result of this spontaneous tournament and has spun it into a great angle.
This wasn't my idea, but branching from this topic some other people I was talking with brought up the idea of making plotless episodes much more frequent just to avoid creative burnout and to make sure the episodes that have plot end up sticking much better. Since I don't think going biweekly is a valid option, making more episodes that are purely wres like EDBW used to be could be something to consider.
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JCW555
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The Archives Guy
Prozach
Mar 10 2016, 08:08 PM
Weldar
Mar 10 2016, 08:00 PM
The real big example I'd point to right now is this whole King Vegeta angle. He got this title from a tournament that came about (If I'm remembering correctly) because TOH didn't have time to do a full show but had just skipped the week before and didn't want to skip two in a row, the writing team took the result of this spontaneous tournament and has spun it into a great angle.
This wasn't my idea, but branching from this topic some other people I was talking with brought up the idea of making plotless episodes much more frequent just to avoid creative burnout and to make sure the episodes that have plot end up sticking much better. Since I don't think going biweekly is a valid option, making more episodes that are purely wres like EDBW used to be could be something to consider.
Maybe not completely plotless, but something like that with shows having minimal plot with more wrestling would solve some of the issues that some people (including me) have about the wrestling not telling the story instead of plot.
Edited by JCW555, Mar 10 2016, 08:26 PM.
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Introbulus
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Occasional no-plot episodes, like the King of the Beach tournament, would also be a fun way to work in a little break - I think we can all agree that the results of that tournament were fantastic, and I'd be willing to see more of that in the future.

That is, if TOH actually wants to do that - I also don't mind seeing more organic plot points form from what happens too.
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Shadowmaster47X
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1000 YEARS!
Introbulus
Mar 10 2016, 09:05 PM
Occasional no-plot episodes, like the King of the Beach tournament, would also be a fun way to work in a little break - I think we can all agree that the results of that tournament were fantastic, and I'd be willing to see more of that in the future.

That is, if TOH actually wants to do that - I also don't mind seeing more organic plot points form from what happens too.
I think some harmless low plot wres nights could do everyone (TOH and Crew especially) some good
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